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VCTS
Sept 3, 2020 21:18:26 GMT -5
Post by kukblue1 on Sept 3, 2020 21:18:26 GMT -5
Is there a right or wrong way to do VCTS. I've been looking at obs from all over the country and honestly i have seen it all over the place. Some sites no remarks at all. Some Sites will put a CB remark. Some sites report TS VC (DIR). What if you see LTG. Is it OCNL LTGICCG VC W TS VC W MOV E IS IT OCNL LTGICCG VC W CB W MOV E. It's not a TS cause you can't hear LTG? Basically no one at my site will ever use VCTS and i know other that won't use it either. I try hard not too but every once in a while there is a time and place for it if it's a small pop up storm and the only storm around.
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VCTS
Sept 4, 2020 5:59:26 GMT -5
Post by weatherwatcher on Sept 4, 2020 5:59:26 GMT -5
We do it as follows
when VCTS pops up. incorrectly or not.
append CB to low cloud group. in rmks we put OCNL LTGIC W TS VC W MOV NE
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VCTS
Sept 4, 2020 5:59:56 GMT -5
Post by weatherwatcher on Sept 4, 2020 5:59:56 GMT -5
OF COURSE LOCATION CAN VARY
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VCTS
Sept 4, 2020 9:14:50 GMT -5
Post by kukblue1 on Sept 4, 2020 9:14:50 GMT -5
We do it as follows when VCTS pops up. incorrectly or not. append CB to low cloud group. in rmks we put OCNL LTGIC W TS VC W MOV NE You don't use VC in LTG remarks?
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VCTS
Sept 4, 2020 9:57:40 GMT -5
Post by weatherwatcher on Sept 4, 2020 9:57:40 GMT -5
no
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VCTS
Sept 4, 2020 10:47:29 GMT -5
Post by fractocu on Sept 4, 2020 10:47:29 GMT -5
When VCTS shows up, it is an ALDARS entry. As we all know, ALDARS has poor track record. Here, at our station, we will only append CB to a cloud layer and add LTG or TS remarks, if we actually see lightning or hear thunder. An observer should only put LTG and TS remarks in the observation for something he or she actually sees or hears. Not based on ALDARS or radar.
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VCTS
Sept 4, 2020 11:13:24 GMT -5
Post by weatherwatcher on Sept 4, 2020 11:13:24 GMT -5
I agree but the FAA sent out the rules to the contractors who sent them to the supervisors. Like kukublue I have seen many ways to encode all the BS that ALDARS puts out. Bottom line is ALDARS Sucks. IMO its fraud to force us to have our initials on an observation that is incorrect but "deemed" correct in order to give legitimacy to a computer program. To my knowledge there is no universal way to do it. If there is please post it. The way I do it is the way I was told by my contractor who was told by the FAA.
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VCTS
Sept 4, 2020 11:23:03 GMT -5
Post by kukblue1 on Sept 4, 2020 11:23:03 GMT -5
I have seen so many different ways. If you see LTG and Aldars is reporting a VCTS don't you need some kind of remark for the VCTS. During the day I get it you can't see LTG you can't hear Thunder so I can see why you would just put CB in Remark but why not put TS VC in remarks. If Aldars is picking up a TS your putting TS in Remarks and not CB all though at that point you probably can hear Thunder. I have seen no remarks at all by the observer when they report VCTS. No CB remark no TS VC remarks.
Even weatherwatcher they don't put VC in their LTG remarks but do for their TS remark. Hell yesterday I saw an ob that had -TSRA with LTGICCG VC E TS VC E even though TS was in present weather. Thunderstorms used to be easy to report Aldars has made it a mess in my option no one seems for sure how to do it. That is why i was basically told never to report VCTS and just to change it to TS
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VCTS
Sept 4, 2020 11:26:14 GMT -5
Post by weatherwatcher on Sept 4, 2020 11:26:14 GMT -5
I think ALDARS could be a useful tool if we could sequence it off once the storms are in the area. Ours cant pick up anything OHD. It will switch a TS and a VCTS right at transmission without ever reflecting it in present weather. It absolutely awful.
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VCTS
Sept 4, 2020 11:37:36 GMT -5
Post by weatherwatcher on Sept 4, 2020 11:37:36 GMT -5
I kinda agree with that except why report a TS when u dont hear thunder?
I bet the ob u are referring to where it was TS in present weather with VCTS rmks was one where the ALDARS switched it at the last second and the observer did not have time to change it.
I strongly feel that the reason for all this confusion is to give legitimacy to ALDARS so the powers that be can say "NO DEGREDATION OF SERVICE" when they try yet again to get rid of us.
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VCTS
Sept 4, 2020 13:31:38 GMT -5
Post by kukblue1 on Sept 4, 2020 13:31:38 GMT -5
I agree I think ALDRS can be useful but there needs to be some kind of standard on what should be reported and how. If it's reporting VCTS do you just need a CB remark? Should it be a VCTS remark. Just cause you don't hear thunder doesn't mean the storm isn't right at 10 miles and small.
10SM VCTS FEW050CB FEW095 OVC200 24/23 A2984 RMK AO2 LTG DSNT SW-N TSE19 PRESRR TS VC SW-N MOV E T02390228 They went with TS VC instead of CB
10SM VCTS -RA SCT055 BKN110 OVC150 26/21 A2987 RMK AO2 LTG DSNT N RAB1958E23B43 TSE06B10 OCNL LTGICCG DSNT N-NE CB DSNT N-NE MOV E P0000 T02560211 They went with LTG within 5 miles but the CB DSNT
10SM VCTS SCT050 BKN120 BKN250 29/17 A2976 RMK AO2 RAE1852 T02940167 PNO $ They went with Nothing
6SM VCTS -RA BKN044CB BKN055 BKN150 OVC250 22/18 A2995 RMK AO2 LTG DSNT S RAB22 OCNL LTGIC VC S TS VC S MOV N P0001 T02220183 They went with LTG and TS VC
10SM VCTS SCT055CB BKN110 BKN250 28/19 A2992 RMK AO2 TSB42 OCNL LTGICCG NE TS NE MOV NE They went with NO VC and this was the same station as the above OB.
Those are only a few obs there are many more but in general these are the types of things I see. Not saying any of it is wrong but my SWO ding mine as an error. I went with the LTG VC and TS VC remark. He claiming it's wrong. I was like show me how it's wrong? There is one standard for VCTS.
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VCTS
Sept 4, 2020 13:48:47 GMT -5
Post by tornado on Sept 4, 2020 13:48:47 GMT -5
Duplicate post.
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VCTS
Sept 4, 2020 13:49:24 GMT -5
Post by tornado on Sept 4, 2020 13:49:24 GMT -5
It would seem that if VCTS appears in present weather, with corresponding remarks entered by the human observer, that would indicate that the human observer doesn't agree that there is a thunderstorm in progress. Otherwise, some sort of TS remarks are in order. Entering TS VC seems quite passé ever since the FAA memo in 2016 instructing observers not to determine the distance to LTG strikes.
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VCTS
Sept 4, 2020 15:46:26 GMT -5
Post by kukblue1 on Sept 4, 2020 15:46:26 GMT -5
It would seem that if VCTS appears in present weather, with corresponding remarks entered by the human observer, that would indicate that the human observer doesn't agree that there is a thunderstorm in progress. Otherwise, some sort of TS remarks are in order. Entering TS VC seems quite passé ever since the FAA memo in 2016 instructing observers not to determine the distance to LTG strikes. So what are you trying to say? Just change it to TS than and be done with it?
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VCTS
Sept 4, 2020 16:13:23 GMT -5
Post by kukblue1 on Sept 4, 2020 16:13:23 GMT -5
I kinda agree with that except why report a TS when u dont hear thunder? I bet the ob u are referring to where it was TS in present weather with VCTS rmks was one where the ALDARS switched it at the last second and the observer did not have time to change it. I strongly feel that the reason for all this confusion is to give legitimacy to ALDARS so the powers that be can say "NO DEGREDATION OF SERVICE" when they try yet again to get rid of us. 042038Z 26008KT 10SM TS SCT060CB OVC340 34/22 A3001 RMK AO2 TSE28B37 OCNL LTGIC VC NW TS VC NW T03440222 042038Z 26008KT 10SM TS SCT060CB OVC340 34/22 A3001 RMK AO2 TSE28B37 OCNL LTGIC VC NW TS VC NW T03440222 Today so the Observer changed it to TS the metar was the same also. Would this be counted as an Error? Should there be more just one way to do TS?
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