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Post by fu on Nov 3, 2015 15:24:19 GMT -5
Federation of P&D is working on a newsletter for PATCO - I just spoke with them a bit ago... they are a good bet to go the AFL-CIO route, but will need lots of encouragement from us. 800-373-5777 If they would show active care about us and communicate their vision about our future to us that would be great. It would be nice if the union sent even our station supervisors a monthly update for them to post in all stations about what the union is doing to help save and promote our job's future. All PATCO sites have a shop steward for the unon to communicate with. Why PATCO refuses to update them on what's going on is a mystery. However many sites remain should give serious thought to leaving PATCO and looking elsewhere. But that's something to think about down the road.
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Post by toofarnorth on Nov 3, 2015 15:34:55 GMT -5
When we left SEIU local 100, we "decertified" them - then joined PATCO later - this was done by NLRB election here in our office by our shop steward - there was no "raiding" by PATCO as we approached them. NATCA offering their members pay raises for doing our work and the MOU with the FAA shows "raiding" and possibly criminal conspiracy. PATCO should be leading the charge to take care of our concerns. Suing PATCO, while tempting, would be fruitless as they really don't have enough $ to pay us all off - a lawsuit would cost us more than $100K, $200K if it goes to a jury trial. I just want to keep my job and the NAS as safe as possible. Sam isn't unapproachable, and he handles relations with our contractor bosses fairly well - but lobbying the FAA and fighting station closures seem to be new to him - that's why he arranged for Jerry Tuso to get back involved. Be careful how antagonistic our contacts with Sam are - he IS on our side.
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Post by fu on Nov 3, 2015 15:41:23 GMT -5
Next time you speak with Sam TFN ask him about the PATCO "lobbyists" he promised would be at the May Safety panel.
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Post by fu on Nov 3, 2015 15:49:09 GMT -5
And why did he wait until last week to bring Jerry back to hold his hand. Jerry offered to come back in May when the closure list first became public. PATCO/FPD didn't want to pay him though.
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Post by toofarnorth on Nov 3, 2015 16:27:26 GMT -5
Fu, the May panels were by invite only if my memory hasn't turned to jelly lately... and PATCO wasn't invited. I'm as disappointed as everyone else at PATCO's lack of communication with us - and that really makes them look really bad. Sam knows where his strengths and weaknesses are - I think... As for Jerry, I haven't tried to communicate with him since he "retired". I believe Jack Seddon is retired too. Not sure how PATCO is going to proceed from here, but they do know what the impact will be - on them and us - if even one more station goes LAWRS/ATC. Sam told me he was talking to Jerry months ago - Jerry was just not acting in any official capacity. Jerry sez (not new) "I will ALWAYS be PATCO." - from the Spring newsletter. I hope his efforts are commensurate with his heart. Meantime, the Union is US, and it is up to US to keep up the good fight, holding on to faith and a good conscience.
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Post by fu on Nov 3, 2015 16:46:01 GMT -5
TFN I agree with some of what you say here. Not sure we should be depending on Sam for any help at all....he's a proven liar wxobservers.freeforums.net/thread/747/"] Also why is half this thread made up of posts trying to figure out who we can find to present the raiding case to the AFL-CIO? That's obviously something Sam and PATCO should be looking into. Shallowfg skobie and others have laid out the case and the contact info of the person in the AFL-CIO to talk to about it. Why haven't they done so? As far as the wage freeze goes that's another of Sam's lies. Most sites got an increase the ones that didn't were told by Sam that this was PATCOs idea to save sites. He even told the people at the sites that they'd make it up next year if you can believe that.
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Post by shallowfg on Nov 4, 2015 8:23:43 GMT -5
I just want to remind everyone that we have a small time period to work with. According to the Tucker email, NATCA and the FAA want to make the transition 3-4 months after concluding the SRMP's.
I support the idea of "decertifying" PATCO and moving to another union. Someone mentioned Teamster Air. They may be a good fit for us. Of course, this would all have to be done with the AFL-CIO's approval and over sight.
If this is the route we choose to take, we need to act soon.
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Post by skobie on Nov 4, 2015 17:24:20 GMT -5
One way or another, guys and gals, we want PATCO to actually work for us and get the ball rolling, so if you're at one of the 57 sites on the list and you fall under PATCO, keep calling, emailing, faxing, sending messenger pigeons, smoke signals, etc. until this guy answers and does something for his people. De-certifying now would be much too late in the game I believe and not an option. I actually wonder how many of the 57 sites do fall under PATCO? I bet I can crosscheck with their website if it's up to date.
skobie
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Post by skobie on Nov 4, 2015 18:10:39 GMT -5
Well, 41 of the 57 sites are PATCO's by my count. That's a lot of Weather Observers banging on Sam (probably close to 300 if you figure roughly 7 per site). Not to mention the people outside of the 57 sites that can get on SAM as PATCO has 103 out of 136 CWO sites across the USA. Let's do it!
skobie
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Post by shallowfg on Nov 5, 2015 8:24:07 GMT -5
I agree with skobie, lets give PATCO the chance to take action on this. It shouldn't take them long to get the ball rolling, maybe two weeks.
I say we give PATCO those two weeks, and if they haven't done anything by then we should look at the option of switching unions. I do not know the process, but I think with the AFL-CIO's help we could get it done.
Just my 2 cents
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Post by rich on Nov 5, 2015 8:35:29 GMT -5
Changing unions takes time, did it years ago from Local 100 to PATCO. Here's some info: aud2.uniondemocracy.org/how-can-we-change-unionsFirst, if you are in an AFL-CIO affiliated union, then you run into the AFL-CIO's "no raiding" rule: no AFL-CIO union can take on the members of another AFL-CIO union for at least a year after the workers leave their old union. This means you can not just switch from CWA, for example, to the Machinists. Instead, you would have to join an existing independent union or form a new union and wait a year before affiliating with the Machinists or some other AFL-CIO union.
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Post by rich on Nov 5, 2015 8:42:15 GMT -5
Therefore, the best option is usually to work to reform the union you are in by organizing the members into a caucus or committee, by running for union office, or taking other actions to put pressure on the union leadership. That is what AUD is here for, to help union members learn how to fight that fight and offer support along the way.
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Post by grwhi065 on Nov 8, 2015 4:46:14 GMT -5
Given how much they want to get rid of us, we gotta figure out why they haven't done so yet, and make sure that happens every time. It is my understanding that what put a stop to this in 2013 was the 4 hour delay in Huntsville Alabama when the LAWRS system went down and no one could augment it. Even if this silly plan is ever put into motion, it will only last as long as the LAWRS systems at the 57 Station last. If one goes down and causes Airport delays the airlines will raise hell and the program will be cancelled and reverted back to CWO. This plan will collapse under the weight of its own stupidity. If airlines and shipping companies stand to lose millions in delayed flights, you can bet their lobbyists in Washington will push this program aside. Perhaps another line of opposition is to ensure the airlines and shipping companies know what is about to happen and how it impacts them both in safety and potential delays.
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skclr
New Member
Posts: 24
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Post by skclr on Nov 9, 2015 7:44:03 GMT -5
Huntsville never went to LAWRS in 2013. You may be thinking of Mobile, AL, where a controller inadvertently toggled the pressure sensor off and several observations were transmitted with a missing AS. This is why the last software version moved the ALDARS sensor to the top of the sensor status page.
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Post by hlsto2 on Nov 9, 2015 12:03:22 GMT -5
I agree with skobie, lets give PATCO the chance to take action on this. It shouldn't take them long to get the ball rolling, maybe two weeks. I say we give PATCO those two weeks, and if they haven't done anything by then we should look at the option of switching unions. I do not know the process, but I think with the AFL-CIO's help we could get it done. Just my 2 cents you would think that PATCO would be doing the math and realize how many dues paying members they might lose
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