|
Post by snowwx on Feb 9, 2015 4:25:57 GMT -5
most controllers i know dont want to mess with aslop...however, the premise that controllers would only do 1-2 specis per hour is false...ATC logs in and thats it...the only reason there would be only 1-2 specis per hour is they are getting tired of hearing the alarm go off and they dont want to cut new atis' its not because they are really watching the wx...additionally, the longer they can keep the field in ifr conditions the more $$ they make, and thats from the union rep. Besides, like as been stated here before, they slap a vis in at 1 mile and forget it..."we forgot" is the excuse we get...that tells me they could care less about wx...ATC has no business doing wx period...i ,as a pilot, have vectored to other facilities because some ATCer has locked aslop down for hours and the wx isnt even close to true reality, hence i say im changing destinations due to inaccurate reported conditions....and even then, the newbie ATCer hasnt got a clue...
|
|
|
Post by hlsto2 on Feb 9, 2015 11:37:30 GMT -5
there should be a mandatory statement in the airport info that "weather reported at this airport may or may not be representative"
|
|
|
Post by hlsto2 on Feb 9, 2015 14:20:06 GMT -5
here are all the ASOS/AWOS sites from Rhode Island. 5 stations...3 errors...
KBID 091915Z AUTO 03015G24KT 5SM OVC004 M01/M04 A2995 RMK AO1 KPVD 091851Z 36015KT 1SM R05/2800V4000FT -SN BR OVC016 M06/M08 A3005 RMK AO2 SFC VIS 1 1/2 SLP175 P0002 T10611083 KSFZ 091915Z 02017G21KT 1/2SM OVC008 M08/M12 A3002 RMK AO1 KUUU 091905Z AUTO 04015G22KT 2 1/2SM -SN BR SCT010 BKN015 OVC032 00/M02 A3000 RMK AO2 P0000 T00001017 KWST 091853Z AUTO 01011G19KT 9SM UP FEW012 OVC026 M02/M04 A2999 RMK AO2 UPB00 SLP154 P0001 I1000 T10221044
|
|
|
Post by TCU 2U2 on Feb 9, 2015 15:24:50 GMT -5
here are all the ASOS/AWOS sites from Rhode Island. 5 stations...3 errors... KBID 091915Z AUTO 03015G24KT 5SM OVC004 M01/M04 A2995 RMK AO1 KPVD 091851Z 36015KT 1SM R05/2800V4000FT -SN BR OVC016 M06/M08 A3005 RMK AO2 SFC VIS 1 1/2 SLP175 P0002 T10611083 KSFZ 091915Z 02017G21KT 1/2SM OVC008 M08/M12 A3002 RMK AO1 KUUU 091905Z AUTO 04015G22KT 2 1/2SM -SN BR SCT010 BKN015 OVC032 00/M02 A3000 RMK AO2 P0000 T00001017 KWST 091853Z AUTO 01011G19KT 9SM UP FEW012 OVC026 M02/M04 A2999 RMK AO2 UPB00 SLP154 P0001 I1000 T10221044 KBID / KSFZ are AO1 sites, no precipitation discriminator so no precipitation or obstruction to vision reported. KWST is AUTO, UP is a valid (since it is stand alone) present weather entry for unmanned report. These are more classic examples of what garbage you get when purchasing limited automated sensors (AO1), or the best that automation can do (UP) without over site of a trained observer.
|
|
|
Post by hlsto2 on Feb 9, 2015 16:29:36 GMT -5
I sometimes don't explain what the errors/shortcoming are because most that come in here should be able to determine what the errors are. if not, they can ask. I think it has been well documented that AWOS either has no present weather capability or many times cannot determine what the pesent weather is. even from an AUTO AWOS, UP is unacceptable. the small airports that were suckered into AWOS junk were proly told by the FAA that it was reliable. the towered sites are for the most part not much better than an AUTO AWOS. The FAA should be ashamed that they are telling usets that towers are equal to CWO's. there is a good database here that can certainly be used if and when the FAA takes another run at the CWO's.
|
|
|
Post by toofarnorth on Feb 9, 2015 18:30:35 GMT -5
Agreed all... except aero0's comment about aslop and the calibrated human eye - no way, even on the darkest night, that aslop can "see" better than we can. The ceilometer will read a dense cloud height directly above it fairly well - a tool that can be used to help train the newby, but NEVER rely on it - unless of course you want to kill someone... We train our observers here to do both sky and vis w/o aslop.
|
|
|
Post by alstein on Feb 9, 2015 18:51:06 GMT -5
it's good for picking out things in the middle of the night that aren't that visible like on new moons that is high.
It's pretty rare for it to be wrong on a cloud height that it detects, but there's plenty that it doesn't. It's really terrible with summertime convective CU fields. Often takes it 1-2 hours to detect the CU even when it's overhead. That said, any decent observer just gets the convective cloud chart out to get a good estimate if they recognize the clouds as convective in nature.
|
|
|
Post by toofarnorth on Feb 10, 2015 15:58:52 GMT -5
Anything falling the atmospheric column above the ceilometer will throw it off - depending on the density of the precip or virga. Some of this really is the bottom falling out of a cloud with the precip. Yes it does measure the reflection accurately - but when it tries to call OVC002 in SKC due to an inversion, I wonder... ASLOP was not designed to operate in temps below M07C...
|
|
|
Post by hlsto2 on Feb 11, 2015 2:14:39 GMT -5
aspen, co, ASOS, reports UP for present weather.
KASE 110553Z AUTO 00000KT 9SM UP OVC046 00/M03 A3019 RMK AO2 UPB25E32B52SNB32E52 SLP182 P0000 60000 T00001028 10039 21011 51013
|
|
|
Post by hlsto2 on Feb 13, 2015 1:15:55 GMT -5
"reliable" ASOS in srn ny cranking out UP for present weather
ELZ 130156Z AUTO 31011G20KT 6SM UP BKN016 OVC027 M19/M23 A2999 RMK AO2 PK WND 31029/0112 SLP202 P0000 T11941233 KELZ 130056Z AUTO 31015G25KT 4SM UP OVC019 M18/M23 A2997 RMK AO2 PK WND 32029/0034 UPB30SNE00 SLP194 P0000 T11831228 KELZ 122356Z AUTO 30019G25KT 3SM -SN OVC016 M17/M22 A2994 RMK AO2 UPE16B43E51SNB51 SLP184 P0000 60000 T11721217 11100 21172 51036 KELZ 122256Z AUTO 30017G23KT 8SM UP OVC022 M16/M21 A2991 RMK AO2 UPB49SNE03 SLP172 P0000 T11611211 KELZ 122156Z AUTO 30022G29KT 3SM -SN OVC018 M14/M19 A2987 RMK AO2 PK WND 30029/2155 UPE2057B10E11SNB2059E10B18 SLP155 P0000 T11441189 KELZ 122105Z AUTO 29015G24KT 7SM -SN BKN024 BKN033 OVC040 M12/M17 A2984 RMK AO2 UPE2057SNB2059 P0000 T11171172 KELZ 122056Z AUTO 30020G25KT 9SM UP FEW025 BKN032 BKN040 M12/M17 A2983 RMK AO2 UPB50SNB01E37 SLP138 P0000 60000 T11171172 53018
|
|
|
Post by hlsto2 on Feb 14, 2015 20:18:11 GMT -5
pennslyvania AWOS site...reporting rain with temps as low as -12C. reporting incorrect snow intensity based on vis. acceptable performance per the FAA
KN38 150055Z AUTO 34015G23KT 1 1/4SM +RA BKN004 BKN014 OVC025 M12/M14 A2956 RMK AO2 KN38 150035Z AUTO 34012G25KT 1 1/4SM +RA SCT006 SCT014 OVC027 M11/M15 A2955 RMK AO2 KN38 150015Z AUTO 32011G28KT 1 3/4SM -SN SCT004 OVC028 M11/M15 A2955 RMK AO2 VIS 3/4V3 KN38 142355Z AUTO 34017G28KT 320V020 3/4SM -SN OVC004 M11/M14 A2953 RMK AO2 KN38 142335Z AUTO 34024G34KT 1/2SM +RA OVC003 M09/M12 A2949 RMK AO2 KN38 142315Z AUTO 35012G22KT 320V020 2SM -RA BKN003 BKN008 OVC024 M09/M11 A2947 RMK AO2 KN38 142255Z AUTO 36007KT 1/2SM -SN OVC003 M08/M10 A2945 RMK AO2 KN38 142235Z AUTO 35009KT 2SM -RA FEW018 BKN026 BKN035 M08/M10 A2942 RMK AO KN38 142215Z AUTO 34008G18KT 320V020 1SM -RA BKN003 BKN016 M08/M10 A2941 RMK AO2 KN38 142155Z AUTO 33011G19KT 1/4SM -SN OVC003 M08/M10 A2940 RMK AO2 KN38 142135Z AUTO 35014G19KT M1/4SM +RA OVC003 M08/M10 A2939 RMK AO2 KN38 142115Z AUTO 21004KT 1/2SM -SN BKN004 OVC012 M06/M07 A2937 RMK AO2 KN38 142055Z AUTO 19009G14KT 1/4SM -RA BKN003 BKN012 BKN018 M06/M07 A2936 RMK AO2 KN38 142035Z AUTO 18011KT 1 1/4SM BR SCT003 BKN013 BKN021 M06/M07 A2936 RMK AO2 KN38 142015Z AUTO 18008KT 1/2SM FZFG BKN004 BKN013 M06/M07 A2936 RMK AO2 KN38 141955Z AUTO 19010KT 1/4SM FZFG OVC004 M06/M07 A2937 RMK AO2 KN38 141935Z AUTO 19011KT 1/4SM -SN OVC004 M06/M07 A2937 RMK AO2
|
|
|
Post by hlsto2 on Feb 14, 2015 20:36:57 GMT -5
zanesville, oh, ASOS, goes belly up, PWINO, and reports HZ instead of the correct present wx ranging from -SN to +SN. reliable...FAA sez so.
KZZV 142133Z AUTO 32013G23KT 1/2SM HZ FEW015 BKN020 OVC030 M09/M13 A2981 RMK AO2 PK WND 33030/2108 T10941128 PWINO FZRANO TSNO $ KZZV 142126Z AUTO 33018G23KT 1SM HZ FEW020 BKN028 OVC036 M09/M14 A2980 RMK AO2 PK WND 33030/2108 PRESRR T10941139 PWINO FZRANO TSNO $ KZZV 142120Z AUTO 34015G24KT 3/4SM HZ FEW022 BKN032 OVC040 M09/M14 A2979 RMK AO2 PK WND 33030/2108 PRESRR T10941144 PWINO FZRANO TSNO $ KZZV 142105Z AUTO 34018G30KT 1/2SM HZ BKN022 OVC036 M09/M14 A2977 RMK AO2 PK WND 34030/2057 T10941139 PWINO FZRANO TSNO $ KZZV 142053Z AUTO 34017G31KT 1/4SM HZ BKN013 OVC035 M09/M13 A2976 RMK AO2 PK WND 33034/2033 UPB21E25SNE21B25SNEMM SLP089 P0000 60002 T10941128 53034 PWINO FZRANO TSNO $ KZZV 142048Z AUTO 34018G34KT M1/4SM HZ BKN011 OVC035 M09/M12 A2975 RMK AO2 PK WND 33034/2033 UPB21E25SNE21B25SNEMM PRESRR P0000 PWINO FZRANO TSNO $
|
|
|
Post by hlsto2 on Feb 14, 2015 22:09:26 GMT -5
reliable ASOS in srn ny goes belly up with PWINO during a significant snow event...not to worry...tech may come out next week and fix it.
KELZ 142351Z AUTO 32023G30KT 2SM HZ OVC017 M13/M17 A2956 RMK AO2 PK WND 30033/2340 VIS 1 1/4V3 PWINO FZRANO $ KELZ 142335Z AUTO 32019G26KT 1SM HZ VV011 M12/M15 A2954 RMK AO2 PK WND 34026/2334 T11221150 PWINO FZRANO $ KELZ 142323Z AUTO 33016G22KT 2 1/2SM HZ OVC012 M12/M14 A2953 RMK AO2 PK WND 33026/2300 T11171144 PWINO FZRANO $ KELZ 142256Z AUTO 33020G27KT 1 1/4SM HZ OVC011 M12/M14 A2950 RMK AO2 PK WND 34031/2224 SLP029 T11171144 PWINO FZRANO $ KELZ 142244Z AUTO 34016G21KT 1 1/2SM HZ OVC011 M12/M14 A2949 RMK AO2 PK WND 34031/2224 T11171144 PWINO FZRANO $ KELZ 142237Z AUTO 33013G28KT 3/4SM HZ VV011 M11/M14 A2948 RMK AO2 PK WND 34031/2224 PRESRR T11111144 PWINO FZRANO $ KELZ 142205Z AUTO 34018KT 1/2SM HZ VV009 M09/M12 A2944 RMK AO2 T10941122 PWINO FZRANO $ KELZ 142156Z AUTO 32012KT 1 1/4SM HZ FEW010 OVC014 M09/M12 A2943 RMK AO2 SLP004 T10941122 PWINO FZRANO $ KELZ 142152Z AUTO 33011KT 1 3/4SM HZ SCT010 OVC017 M09/M12 A2943 RMK AO2 PRESRR PWINO FZRANO $ KELZ 142138Z AUTO 34010KT 3SM HZ FEW014 BKN021 OVC038 M09/M12 A2942 RMK AO2 T10891117 PWINO FZRANO $ KELZ 142132Z AUTO 34012G21KT 1SM HZ BKN015 OVC031 M09/M12 A2941 RMK AO2 T10891122 PWINO FZRANO $ KELZ 142129Z AUTO 33015G21KT 3/4SM HZ VV014 M09/M12 A2941 RMK AO2 T10891122 PWINO FZRANO $ KELZ 142124Z AUTO 33014G20KT 1 1/2SM HZ FEW010 OVC016 M09/M12 A2940 RMK AO2 T10891117 PWINO FZRANO $ KELZ 142056Z AUTO 34010G18KT 1SM HZ SCT009 OVC014 M09/M12 A2939 RMK AO2 SLP988 P0001 60002 T10891117 53006 PWINO FZRANO $ KELZ 142032Z AUTO 33015G20KT 1SM HZ VV010 M09/M12 A2938 RMK AO2 P0001 T10891117 PWINO FZRANO $ KELZ 141956Z AUTO 34013G21KT 1/2SM FZFG VV005 M09/M11 A2936 RMK AO2 PK WND 29029/1934 WSHFT 1933 SNEMM SLP979 P0001 T10891106 PWINO FZRANO $ KELZ 141947Z AUTO 32017G26KT 1/4SM HZ BKN008 OVC019 M08/M11 A2936 RMK AO2 PK WND 29029/1934 WSHFT 1933 SNEMM PRESRR P0001 T10831111 PWINO FZRANO $ KELZ 141939Z AUTO 31017G29KT 1/4SM +SN BKN012 BKN019 OVC038 M07/M11 A2935 RMK AO2 PK WND 29029/1934 P0000 T10721111
|
|
|
Post by hlsto2 on Feb 15, 2015 12:28:49 GMT -5
this "reliable" AWOS in VT does not report SKY, WIND, or VIS
K1V4 151654Z AUTO M16/M22 A2975 RMK AO1 SLP098 T11561217 K1V4 151554Z AUTO M16/M22 A2976 RMK AO1 SLP101 P0001 T11611222 K1V4 151454Z AUTO M17/M22 A2973 RMK AO1 SLP094 T11671217 51037 K1V4 151354Z AUTO M16/M20 A2971 RMK AO1 SLP083 T11561200 K1V4 151254Z AUTO M16/M19 A2967 RMK AO1 SLP071 T11561194 K1V4 151154Z AUTO M15/M18 A2962 RMK AO1 SLP055 60001 70016 T11501183 11111 21150 53029
|
|
|
Post by hlsto2 on Feb 15, 2015 12:30:40 GMT -5
and this "reliable" AWOS in VT reports incorrect snow intensity based on vis at 1235 and 1335Z
K6B0 151335Z AUTO 36020G35KT 1/2SM -SN OVC019 M18/M21 A2982 RMK AO2 T11801215 K6B0 151315Z AUTO 36017G27KT 3/4SM -SN OVC015 M18/M21 A2981 RMK AO2 T11801210 K6B0 151255Z AUTO 35014G22KT 3/4SM -SN OVC011 M17/M20 A2980 RMK AO2 T11751203 K6B0 151235Z AUTO 36014G26KT 1/2SM -SN OVC013 M17/M20 A2978 RMK AO2 T11721200
|
|