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Post by rich on Jun 6, 2016 20:21:22 GMT -5
My turn to unload... It would be counterproductive for me to "out" the contractors posting to this board - they know who I am, and it would be a simple matter for them to just reregister under another member name. Why endanger my own job for no gain? I know they can reregister easily as this has happened at least once - after I outed one contractor about three years ago... and he was one of the good guys. I should remind contractors that it is illegal for them to interfere with union organizing or negotiations - and several are in negotiations right now, Sam says. Our union is doing a decent job of representing us, period. Scaring our brother observers away with this hateful fantasy drives me (and Sam) livid with anger. It is in the contractor's interest as well as our own to work together to preserve the CWO program; but contractors beware - there will be lawsuits filed if interference can be proved. Nothing personal from me to the contractors here, but time for them to back off. Hey TFN that's quite the bizarre post from a few weeks back and I apologize if my posts here made you and your buddy Sam "livid with anger". Since you now think I'm a contractor why don't you get PATCO to file a lawsuit against me for "interference"? Message me and I'll send you my contact info so you can pass it along to them.
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Post by zoomthundersnow on Jun 6, 2016 23:03:04 GMT -5
Rich is not a Contractor Too Far North and I'm not either. I'll personally vouch for him and state it as fact that he is not trying to interfere with PATCO/Contractor negotiations. I belong to the Teamster's Union also through my part time job, and receive Union News from them directly, good or bad, I think it's the way it works.
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Post by TCU 2U2 on Jun 7, 2016 5:36:00 GMT -5
I don't know/haven't heard anything about a union-approved "pay freeze", except as a scare tactic from unsavory contractors. To much going on behind the scenes at the moment to give this thread any valuable time, however I must jump in to tell you TFN, there was a pay freeze imposed by the union at my site (and at least a handful of others that I have a working relationship with) for FY16 .... the story goes that the unions lobbyists suggested during the summer of 2015 to freeze pay raises as the program was (and still is btw) under the gun.
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Post by coldlover on Jun 7, 2016 7:10:49 GMT -5
Rich is not a Contractor Too Far North and I'm not either. I'll personally vouch for him and state it as fact that he is not trying to interfere with PATCO/Contractor negotiations. . +1
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Post by TCU 2U2 on Jun 7, 2016 8:31:48 GMT -5
I don't know/haven't heard anything about a union-approved "pay freeze", except as a scare tactic from unsavory contractors. To much going on behind the scenes at the moment to give this thread any valuable time, however I must jump in to tell you TFN, there was a pay freeze imposed by the union at my site (and at least a handful of others that I have a working relationship with) for FY16 .... the story goes that the unions lobbyists suggested during the summer of 2015 to freeze pay raises as the program was (and still is btw) under the gun. A follow up to my earlier post ... Here is part of an email from a shop steward up in this region: Dated August 13, 2015: Apparently Sam has spoken with contractors and the reality is that we will not get any pay raises this year. However, I was told we will get an extra increase next year to account for no raise this year. Basically, we double what we would normally get in a given year. I was told by Sam that he was dealing with a lobbyist and it was recommended that we get no raise this year in order to try and help our job status moving forward. With the FAA cash strapped, the hope is that the lobbyist/patco can argue on our behalf that we received no raise. Therefore, it may have an impact on our CWO program moving forward in a positive manner.
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Post by rich on Jun 7, 2016 9:07:37 GMT -5
That mysterious PATCO lobbyist sure gets around. First showed up last May: May 13, 2015 at 1:35pm chachiman said: Guys, This is the deal! Sam just assured me after talking and voicing our concerns to him for about 15 minutes that we would have a voice at the meeting. He said that they have a lobbyist group that will be inside at the meeting. They will be voicing the bad decision once again this will be. Read more: wxobservers.freeforums.net/thread/695/official-communication-patco#ixzz4Atx4SZi1As we all know no PATCO lobbyist attended that meeting. Then the PATCO "lobbyist" recommends a pay freeze for a few sites last summer. That worked out well. I've lost track of the numerous attempts by TFN to explain who PATCO's lobbyists are in this thread, first it was Jerry, then it was Sam with a S Fl coalition of Senators and congressmen, then it was some guy named Dennis with Jerry and Mark doing "stuff". I think the last explanation was that everyone is a lobbyist. Yet PATCO's financials show $0 spent on a lobbyist. I wonder what the truth is.
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Post by micatlwx on Jun 7, 2016 12:53:12 GMT -5
TO EVERYONE THAT HAS BEEN BITCHING ABOUT PATCO HAVE ANY OF YOU PICKED UP THE PHONE AND CALLED MARK DIRECTLY THE NUMBER IS 1-800-373-5777 AND VOICED YOUR CONCERNS TO HIM DIRECTLY. I JUST WISH PEOPLE WOULD USE THIS FORUM IN A POSITIVE WAY TO VOICE THEIR CONCERNS INSTEAD OF A PLACE TO BASH ORGANIZATIONS AND PEOPLE. THIS IS A TIME THAT WE ALL NEED TO BOND TOGETHER WITH THE UNION AND EACH OTHER TO FIGHT THIS ISSUE OF THE CWO CLOSURE WHICH IS MOSTLY POLITICAL IN NATURE ANYWAY NOT TO SAY THAT THE FAA WOULD NOT CLOSE SOME OF THE SMALLER WEATHER STATIONS IF THEY DID NOT RECIEVE MONEY FROM CONGRESS. SWO STANDS FOR SENIOR WEATHER OBSERVER THIS MEANS YOU ARE A LEADER AND ARE SUPPOSED TO STAND UP FOR YOUR EMPLOYEES, HAVE A GOOD PROFESSIONAL RELATIONSHIP WITH YOUR CONTRACTOR AND MAKE SURE THEY GET WHAT THEY NEED NOT JUST JOIN IN THE PROPAGANDA AND BITCHING ON THIS FORUM. A POSITIVE ATTITUDE AND TAKING ACTION GOES A LONG WAY. WE HAVE ALREADY HAD ONE SMALL VICTORY JUST IMAGINE WHAT WE CAN ACCOMPLISH IF WE ALL STUCK TOGETHER AS ONE UNIT. WHAT THE MIND CAN CONCEIVE AND BELIEVE IT CAN ACHIEVE. IT SEEMS LIKE AFTER READING ALOT OF THE POSTS ON HERE THAT MOST OF YOU HAVE LET FEAR TAKE OVER YOU. FEAR STANDS FOR FALSE EVIDENCE APPEARING REAL. STAY POSITIVE,COMMUNICATE WITH YOUR CONTRACTORS, YOU SENATORS AND THE UNION AND LETS BE VICTORIOUS
SINCERELY
MICATLWX
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Post by chachiman on Jun 7, 2016 13:20:45 GMT -5
TO EVERYONE THAT HAS BEEN BITCHING ABOUT PATCO HAVE ANY OF YOU PICKED UP THE PHONE AND CALLED MARK DIRECTLY THE NUMBER IS 1-800-373-5777 AND VOICED YOUR CONCERNS TO HIM DIRECTLY. I JUST WISH PEOPLE WOULD USE THIS FORUM IN A POSITIVE WAY TO VOICE THEIR CONCERNS INSTEAD OF A PLACE TO BASH ORGANIZATIONS AND PEOPLE. THIS IS A TIME THAT WE ALL NEED TO BOND TOGETHER WITH THE UNION AND EACH OTHER TO FIGHT THIS ISSUE OF THE CWO CLOSURE WHICH IS MOSTLY POLITICAL IN NATURE ANYWAY NOT TO SAY THAT THE FAA WOULD NOT CLOSE SOME OF THE SMALLER WEATHER STATIONS IF THEY DID NOT RECIEVE MONEY FROM CONGRESS. SWO STANDS FOR SENIOR WEATHER OBSERVER THIS MEANS YOU ARE A LEADER AND ARE SUPPOSED TO STAND UP FOR YOUR EMPLOYEES, HAVE A GOOD PROFESSIONAL RELATIONSHIP WITH YOUR CONTRACTOR AND MAKE SURE THEY GET WHAT THEY NEED NOT JUST JOIN IN THE PROPAGANDA AND BITCHING ON THIS FORUM. A POSITIVE ATTITUDE AND TAKING ACTION GOES A LONG WAY. WE HAVE ALREADY HAD ONE SMALL VICTORY JUST IMAGINE WHAT WE CAN ACCOMPLISH IF WE ALL STUCK TOGETHER AS ONE UNIT. WHAT THE MIND CAN CONCEIVE AND BELIEVE IT CAN ACHIEVE. IT SEEMS LIKE AFTER READING ALOT OF THE POSTS ON HERE THAT MOST OF YOU HAVE LET FEAR TAKE OVER YOU. FEAR STANDS FOR FALSE EVIDENCE APPEARING REAL. STAY POSITIVE,COMMUNICATE WITH YOUR CONTRACTORS, YOU SENATORS AND THE UNION AND LETS BE VICTORIOUS SINCERELY MICATLWX I could not AGREE more! Thank you for posting!
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Post by coldlover on Jun 7, 2016 13:33:42 GMT -5
TO EVERYONE THAT HAS BEEN BITCHING ABOUT PATCO HAVE ANY OF YOU PICKED UP THE PHONE AND CALLED MARK DIRECTLY THE NUMBER IS 1-800-373-5777 AND VOICED YOUR CONCERNS TO HIM DIRECTLY. I JUST WISH PEOPLE WOULD USE THIS FORUM IN A POSITIVE WAY TO VOICE THEIR CONCERNS INSTEAD OF A PLACE TO BASH ORGANIZATIONS AND PEOPLE. THIS IS A TIME THAT WE ALL NEED TO BOND TOGETHER WITH THE UNION AND EACH OTHER TO FIGHT THIS ISSUE OF THE CWO CLOSURE WHICH IS MOSTLY POLITICAL IN NATURE ANYWAY NOT TO SAY THAT THE FAA WOULD NOT CLOSE SOME OF THE SMALLER WEATHER STATIONS IF THEY DID NOT RECIEVE MONEY FROM CONGRESS. SWO STANDS FOR SENIOR WEATHER OBSERVER THIS MEANS YOU ARE A LEADER AND ARE SUPPOSED TO STAND UP FOR YOUR EMPLOYEES, HAVE A GOOD PROFESSIONAL RELATIONSHIP WITH YOUR CONTRACTOR AND MAKE SURE THEY GET WHAT THEY NEED NOT JUST JOIN IN THE PROPAGANDA AND BITCHING ON THIS FORUM. A POSITIVE ATTITUDE AND TAKING ACTION GOES A LONG WAY. WE HAVE ALREADY HAD ONE SMALL VICTORY JUST IMAGINE WHAT WE CAN ACCOMPLISH IF WE ALL STUCK TOGETHER AS ONE UNIT. WHAT THE MIND CAN CONCEIVE AND BELIEVE IT CAN ACHIEVE. IT SEEMS LIKE AFTER READING ALOT OF THE POSTS ON HERE THAT MOST OF YOU HAVE LET FEAR TAKE OVER YOU. FEAR STANDS FOR FALSE EVIDENCE APPEARING REAL. STAY POSITIVE,COMMUNICATE WITH YOUR CONTRACTORS, YOU SENATORS AND THE UNION AND LETS BE VICTORIOUS SINCERELY MICATLWX Many of us have contacted Patco numerous times only to get crickets as a result. I have never spoken with Mark,, but some Sam guy that appears to work for us as a PATCO lawyer-- or at least a message. I'am not bitching-- just stating a fact that when your lied to over and over again and press for info, only to get lies as more info, (as you find out later) that gets old. Several of us -- that have lead the charge- have not let fear take over, but stood up to the bully that is the FAA and several of us have had face to face meetings with our actual Reps in Congress. Not phone calls with an aide or emails with Suzy Secretary. The real deal and that takes WORK-TIME and PERSISTENCE. That is what has saved us for the time being, along with a Coalition of 6 contractors forking the $$ to pay for lobbyists. Would like to know exactly who the PATCO lobbyists are as this question was asked about a month ago and no one in the inner circle of CWO deal in DC had a clue who PATCO was. IF I'am wrong-- please correct me. Fear is throwing in the towel or the thought of throwing it in (still the same mentally) ,, collapsing, with no hope you believe you have left. Drink the saltwater. Feed the sharks. Many did just that late last Fall. See the Fbook page. Those are the fear mongers. You seem to have potential-- but what is it you have exactly done this time around to help save the program? You seem to know how to fight. We can use you!! But, I would have thought I would have heard from you before this if you were serious about saving the entire program.
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Post by toofarnorth on Jun 7, 2016 13:49:34 GMT -5
Mark & Sam have been given the directory and have many of the email addresses for the SWOs. And yes Rich, I'm more than a little pissed, but I don't hold grudges for more than a short time. There have been others who couldn't stand PATCO - like Coco & Fu, whose postings I haven't seen in a while. My point - together we stand, period. And the only thing it takes for evil to triumph is for good folks to do nothing. Stop sniping, and contribute something worthwhile.
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Post by toofarnorth on Jun 7, 2016 13:58:58 GMT -5
Lobbyist funding is from higher up the food chain than PATCO. When you call your congressman with a pom or to request something on behalf of another (may include yourself), you are lobbying. It really is that simple. The financial form that was posted here is required in that format by law, so PATCO showed $0 for "lobbyists".
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Post by toofarnorth on Jun 7, 2016 14:14:12 GMT -5
TO EVERYONE THAT HAS BEEN BITCHING ABOUT PATCO HAVE ANY OF YOU PICKED UP THE PHONE AND CALLED MARK DIRECTLY THE NUMBER IS 1-800-373-5777 AND VOICED YOUR CONCERNS TO HIM DIRECTLY. I JUST WISH PEOPLE WOULD USE THIS FORUM IN A POSITIVE WAY TO VOICE THEIR CONCERNS INSTEAD OF A PLACE TO BASH ORGANIZATIONS AND PEOPLE. THIS IS A TIME THAT WE ALL NEED TO BOND TOGETHER WITH THE UNION AND EACH OTHER TO FIGHT THIS ISSUE OF THE CWO CLOSURE WHICH IS MOSTLY POLITICAL IN NATURE ANYWAY NOT TO SAY THAT THE FAA WOULD NOT CLOSE SOME OF THE SMALLER WEATHER STATIONS IF THEY DID NOT RECIEVE MONEY FROM CONGRESS. SWO STANDS FOR SENIOR WEATHER OBSERVER THIS MEANS YOU ARE A LEADER AND ARE SUPPOSED TO STAND UP FOR YOUR EMPLOYEES, HAVE A GOOD PROFESSIONAL RELATIONSHIP WITH YOUR CONTRACTOR AND MAKE SURE THEY GET WHAT THEY NEED NOT JUST JOIN IN THE PROPAGANDA AND BITCHING ON THIS FORUM. A POSITIVE ATTITUDE AND TAKING ACTION GOES A LONG WAY. WE HAVE ALREADY HAD ONE SMALL VICTORY JUST IMAGINE WHAT WE CAN ACCOMPLISH IF WE ALL STUCK TOGETHER AS ONE UNIT. WHAT THE MIND CAN CONCEIVE AND BELIEVE IT CAN ACHIEVE. IT SEEMS LIKE AFTER READING ALOT OF THE POSTS ON HERE THAT MOST OF YOU HAVE LET FEAR TAKE OVER YOU. FEAR STANDS FOR FALSE EVIDENCE APPEARING REAL. STAY POSITIVE,COMMUNICATE WITH YOUR CONTRACTORS, YOU SENATORS AND THE UNION AND LETS BE VICTORIOUS SINCERELY MICATLWX Thank you, MICATLWX. I started working on this thread with the same goal in mind - but some apparently are unwilling to accept anything short of the destruction of PATCO and a full apology from their members, while they seem to sit on their hands and do nothing - expecting someone else to do it for them - we need EVERYONE involved in this effort - Congress gave the FAA a path to continued effort to close us - just a one year moratorium on closures, while they revamp their SRMP process. I am not blind to human shortcomings! None of us are perfect or sinless but we all need to work together - even the contractors with us. Courage is the determination to do things in spite of our fear.
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Post by rich on Jun 7, 2016 14:18:47 GMT -5
Lobbyist funding is from higher up the food chain than PATCO. When you call your congressman with a pom or to request something on behalf of another (may include yourself), you are lobbying. It really is that simple. The financial form that was posted here is required in that format by law, so PATCO showed $0 for "lobbyists". Is that your final answer on this lobbyist question? What about the lobbyists PATCO claimed would be at the DC meeting in the post I posted by Chachiman from last year, or the lobbyist that TCU said recommended a pay freeze to Sam for some of the sites last year?
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Post by rich on Jun 7, 2016 14:22:04 GMT -5
Mark & Sam have been given the directory and have many of the email addresses for the SWOs. And yes Rich, I'm more than a little pissed, but I don't hold grudges for more than a short time. There have been others who couldn't stand PATCO - like Coco & Fu, whose postings I haven't seen in a while. My point - together we stand, period. And the only thing it takes for evil to triumph is for good folks to do nothing. Stop sniping, and contribute something worthwhile. It took the people who put that directory together a few weeks to do that. Sam has been on the job for almost a year and a half, why did he need the directory to get the contact info for PATCO sites?
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Post by rich on Jun 7, 2016 14:24:19 GMT -5
TO EVERYONE THAT HAS BEEN BITCHING ABOUT PATCO HAVE ANY OF YOU PICKED UP THE PHONE AND CALLED MARK DIRECTLY THE NUMBER IS 1-800-373-5777 AND VOICED YOUR CONCERNS TO HIM DIRECTLY. I JUST WISH PEOPLE WOULD USE THIS FORUM IN A POSITIVE WAY TO VOICE THEIR CONCERNS INSTEAD OF A PLACE TO BASH ORGANIZATIONS AND PEOPLE. THIS IS A TIME THAT WE ALL NEED TO BOND TOGETHER WITH THE UNION AND EACH OTHER TO FIGHT THIS ISSUE OF THE CWO CLOSURE WHICH IS MOSTLY POLITICAL IN NATURE ANYWAY NOT TO SAY THAT THE FAA WOULD NOT CLOSE SOME OF THE SMALLER WEATHER STATIONS IF THEY DID NOT RECIEVE MONEY FROM CONGRESS. SWO STANDS FOR SENIOR WEATHER OBSERVER THIS MEANS YOU ARE A LEADER AND ARE SUPPOSED TO STAND UP FOR YOUR EMPLOYEES, HAVE A GOOD PROFESSIONAL RELATIONSHIP WITH YOUR CONTRACTOR AND MAKE SURE THEY GET WHAT THEY NEED NOT JUST JOIN IN THE PROPAGANDA AND BITCHING ON THIS FORUM. A POSITIVE ATTITUDE AND TAKING ACTION GOES A LONG WAY. WE HAVE ALREADY HAD ONE SMALL VICTORY JUST IMAGINE WHAT WE CAN ACCOMPLISH IF WE ALL STUCK TOGETHER AS ONE UNIT. WHAT THE MIND CAN CONCEIVE AND BELIEVE IT CAN ACHIEVE. IT SEEMS LIKE AFTER READING ALOT OF THE POSTS ON HERE THAT MOST OF YOU HAVE LET FEAR TAKE OVER YOU. FEAR STANDS FOR FALSE EVIDENCE APPEARING REAL. STAY POSITIVE,COMMUNICATE WITH YOUR CONTRACTORS, YOU SENATORS AND THE UNION AND LETS BE VICTORIOUS SINCERELY MICATLWX Thank you, MICATLWX. I started working on this thread with the same goal in mind - but some apparently are unwilling to accept anything short of the destruction of PATCO and a full apology from their members, while they seem to sit on their hands and do nothing - expecting someone else to do it for them - we need EVERYONE involved in this effort - Congress gave the FAA a path to continued effort to close us - just a one year moratorium on closures, while they revamp their SRMP process. I am not blind to human shortcomings! None of us are perfect or sinless but we all need to work together - even the contractors with us. Courage is the determination to do things in spite of our fear. No offense intended TFN but you really don't have a clue what you are talking about.
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